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replace keith rowe with toshimaru nakamura
What does o/ means?
music related thoughts wastebin
- Thread starter mochi
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many people listen to music as often as i do, but with a significantly more limited range. perhaps there are people who have listened to music for double the total length i have, but have heard almost no albums. only Playlists and Personal Autogenerated Recommended We Think You’ll Just Love It Brand New 50 Million Play Artist Mixes. "music is my life!", though! but during conversation about music anything outside of their microscopic comfort zone is met with the digital equivalent of a blank stare. generic indifference with (likely unintended) implied ignoring. anything not normal enough is often met with anger or derision, no matter how you frame the subject. even people not involved in the conversation might start mocking you, even more annoyingly people who decide it's "pretentious" from already hearing about it before either from someone who tried to show it to them, or from perceiving it as some kind of trivia piece they saw on youtube or tiktok or something
WHY does it trigger such emotions, though? why is it that interesting things made in interesting ways confuses and offends people? we're not talking about 2010s /mu/ elitist discussion tactics, we're talking about normal conversation. it doesn't make sense to me. off the top of my head, all i can think of for music that made me think negatively of those who showed it to me are artists that signify very specific subcultures (e.g. hyperpop subgenres) or music which exudes certain personalities i can't ignore (e.g. hobo johnson). you'll occasionally come across someone who listens to punk, metal or hardstyle, something specific that most normalfriends wouldn't know much about in the first place. of course, those people will be more open to extremes and be easier to talk about extreme music with. WRONG. they love punk but a band like siege is too scary and non-musical. they love metal but a band like cephalotripsy is too scary and non-musical. they love hardstyle and gabber but nasenbluten is too scary and non-musical. they're the same kind of small-range people, it's just their range is in a different area. it's probably just from their parents
the obvious way is to ease into more extreme music, which is like some kind of long-term psychological operation for the sake of possibly getting one person to maybe like cooler music. you could try to use something more melodic, some kind of ambient or rock-band based music with crossover appeal. something normally gay like the caretaker or william basinski could work here (ironically, out of the "big" names those 2 are the most outright literal pretentious artists) since their music simply just sounds "nice" and their releases have simple concepts. velvet underground and brian eno seemed to do the trick for many people pre-internet. but let's just assume someone does listen to these and likes it. a lot of experimental rawk can be firmly rooted in "acceptable" music while messing around with its foundations. but then what
what do?
how do you get past that giant barrier of "um... this isn't even music?" that plagues anything avant-garde that gets any amount of exposure to the general public? if i don't even understand what makes these people so repulsed, i don't know what i'm meant to do in the first place.. occasionally something escapes containment such as whitehouse's why you never became a dancer, throbbing gristle's hamburger lady or karl mayer's ep. people are clearly interested in these beyond the surface level "haha wow creepy stuff, huh!" and they're making some kind of real contact between their minds and the music, but it's like they can't make the connections and figure out that they're enjoying the music as art and for the pure qualities of its sounds. they find it interesting for probably the same reason as me, but they're not aware of it. how do i explain it? should we kill these people or brainwash them?
is this the example of super-mainstream exposure of with absolutely no sense of novelty, gimmickry or attachment to some soundtrack, event, etc? laurie anderson's o superman doesn't count because it's just an a capella pop song with effects and then a synth to make it not a capella and also it sucks
i have not proofread ANY of this and i will not fix anything i've accidentally stated twice or where i've veered off into a differentpoint
†please do not respond to this post if you don’t think yoko ono was the only good part of the beatles
WE MUST FIGGER OUT THIS CONUNDRUM. THE WORLD WILL SOON END
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my experience telling normies i like avant-garde music has been generally positive, but by this i mean describing the music to them rather than making them listen to it. many people have seemed somewhat curious and fascinated, while others just move the conversation to something else. i haven't had anyone say something rude or sceptical of my sincerity when i've said that i like experimental improvised music, which is something i've said to dozens of people irl. some people will respond positively by connecting what i'm describing to something they like and *think* is "experimental," but actually isn't. like after i gave a presentation on onkyokei to a room full of people, one of them started asking me if i know about some japanese neo-psychedelia indie band he liked.
my "strategy" for "converting" people is just to get them to make a rym account and then leave them to explore and read about more music on their own. curious people naturally will. it does probably start with something like the velvet underground long before anything without melody -- you need to first start thinking about music as an artform in which sounds, harmonies, and concepts are explored rather than simply a medium revolving around creating catchy melodies or "bangers." people who already like Actual Good Music (e.g., the velvet underground) are, in my experience, almost always interested in listening to *noisier* and/or more complex music, but music without melody is a different thing entirely. the same people just become bored and say they don't "get it." i think you either feel captivated and fascinated by truly avant-garde music or you don't. i don't think there's really a way of easing into it -- "pleasant" drone and ambient seems like it'd just teach them to listen to experimental music as background music. maybe noise music could be the bridge (since it isn't pleasant), but like i said earlier, i don't really micromanage or tinker with people's taste like this. i just try to get them exposed to a much wider range/variety of music in album form.
the people with a seething hatred of avantmusic are usually spergs who already really like some other genre of music (usually metal, sometimes prog rock and classical) and feel the need to gatekeep the music fandom from people they don't want to see advancing a way of approaching music that wouldn't be compatible with ranking the things they like as objectively superior. i think casuals are much more likely to seethe at abstract visual art because it is often bourgeois and they associate it with rich snobs (or LIBTARDS) and a world they feel excluded from. avantmusic is something much lesser known and will more often be seen as a quaint curiousity, especially if you're talking about an underground scene.
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somewhat related because it has to do with intentionally improving people's music tastes: the concept of "patriciancore" charts (and similar charts) was, at least in the way i created them, designed to facilitate people branching out into more experimental music (or just music in languages other than english or just more "obscure music") but on a community-wide scale. so when i made those, i selected albums that were either more challenging than /mu/core without being *too* challenging, or i just selected extremely unchallenging albums i thought could have wider appeal if more people gave them a chance (i was correct when i picked fishmans for this, which skyrocketed in popularity and now looks silly even being included on those charts)
all of the images focused on creating a gradient of progressively more experimental music were also obviously intended to push people toward listening to more of it at their own pace. the most successful instance of this was probably my infamous "music iceberg" which imo launched the somewhat cancerous and gay "iceberg meme" and also caused all of the artists i placed at the bottom of the iceberg to get spammed by stupid people (youtube comment pages and rym comment boxes etc). this basically meant i had kamikaze'd my own taste since i was mainly placing my favourite artists towards the bottom. i remember my e-friends getting mad at me for launching this psychological operation because we should be focused on gatekeeping the normies and pushing them away rather than turning good music into meme music.
all of the images focused on creating a gradient of progressively more experimental music were also obviously intended to push people toward listening to more of it at their own pace. the most successful instance of this was probably my infamous "music iceberg" which imo launched the somewhat cancerous and gay "iceberg meme" and also caused all of the artists i placed at the bottom of the iceberg to get spammed by stupid people (youtube comment pages and rym comment boxes etc). this basically meant i had kamikaze'd my own taste since i was mainly placing my favourite artists towards the bottom. i remember my e-friends getting mad at me for launching this psychological operation because we should be focused on gatekeeping the normies and pushing them away rather than turning good music into meme music.